XSF Discussion - 2020-11-03

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  206. Seve XEP-0367: Message Attaching https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0367.html XEP-0422: Message Fastening https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0422.html Has been there any discussion regarding the similarities of these two?
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  209. jonas’ yes
  210. jonas’ a lot
  211. jonas’ well, not a lot, but a bit
  212. jonas’ here’s the thread: https://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/standards/2019-September/036421.html
  213. Seve jonas’ Thank you ❤
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  252. jubalh Does anyone know whether there were any plans to bring XMPP to KaiOS? I'm not sure about the limitations of the OS
  253. Zash FirefoxOS fork? Any web client should work then
  254. jubalh so that means like open a browser and use it there? so no push notifications, right?
  255. Daniel Doesn't it support web push?
  256. Daniel Even if web push hasn't been implemented in your favorite web client yet it should be fairly easy to retrofit
  257. jubalh maybe i should get such a phone and try it ou
  258. jubalh maybe i should get such a phone and try it out
  259. jubalh my smartphone just died :/
  260. Daniel What's the appeal of KaiOS?
  261. Daniel Aside from being the operating system of one fairly cheap phone in India
  262. Daniel Aside from being the operating system of _one_ fairly cheap phone in India
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  264. jubalh It's not KaiOS per se that interests me. More like getting a more durable phone that isnt too expensive
  265. jubalh I'm thinking about Nokia 800 Tough or Hammer 5
  266. jubalh But I would need XMPP for sure
  267. jubalh And not running android would have the downside of not being able to use the DB App and Audible
  268. jubalh Otherwise the simplye thing would probably be fine
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  272. Zash I have a FirefoxOS device in a drawer somewhere.
  273. Zash It was cheap. It feels cheap. But you could easily package webapps for it iirc.
  274. jubalh thats good to hear :)
  275. Link Mauve jubalh, I recently bought a PinePhone, still waiting to receive it.
  276. Link Mauve Dino is an obvious client to run there.
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  279. Link Mauve I’ve never tested Android for more than a few minutes on someone else’s phone, so I wouldn’t miss its applications.
  280. jubalh Link Mauve: right, that would also be interesting from a foss perspective and i'm interested in buiding gtk apps myself to run on the phone. but not as durable as i'm looking for :)
  281. jubalh Link Mauve: so what kind of phones did you use so far if not android?
  282. Link Mauve jubalh, my first smartphone was the OpenMoko FreeRunner, in 2008, I’ve kept it ever since but with the battery pretty much dead I haven’t used it much in the last years.
  283. inky pinephone is amazing, contgraturalions.
  284. Link Mauve Then two years ago my mother gave me a 15€ dumb phone, which I’ve used when I needed to be called or to send SMS, and that’s it.
  285. inky i used openmoko with shr/qtmoko, then liked maemo devices a lot. now have a couple of commits to maemo-leste, i like that project a lot.
  286. inky and i mainly use sailfish.
  287. Link Mauve Prior to the OpenMoko I’ve had an i-mode phone.
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  290. Link Mauve inky, given my usage of the OpenMoko was more as a pocket computer when I was in high school, I stopped relying on it once I got a laptop.
  291. Link Mauve XMPP > SMS.
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  307. Ge0rG One can't simply retrofit desktop applications for mobile touch, even when they share the same widget toolkit
  308. Zash Miller columns!
  309. Link Mauve Ge0rG, hold my grenadine. :p
  310. Ge0rG Link Mauve: I'll sip a bit on it while you are in your self imposed world of suffering.
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  351. jubalh Ge0rG: noone said so. did someone?
  352. jubalh libhandy will make it easier though
  353. Alex The clock is ticking, let get some more applications in for board adn council: https://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Board_and_Council_Elections_2020
  354. Ge0rG Oh no, I've written the page but forgot to link it!
  355. Ge0rG (and the wiki still sucks on mobile)
  356. Alex 😀
  357. Ge0rG But I still have some days left, right? Right?!?
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  359. Ge0rG Phew, did it in time.
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  361. jonas’ woo competition!
  362. Ge0rG Board is still underseated
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  383. antranigv can anyone be a board member?
  384. antranigv :P
  385. MattJ Anyone who applies and gets voted in, yes :)
  386. MattJ You don't even need to be an XSF member already
  387. Ge0rG antranigv: https://xmpp.org/about/xsf/bylaws scroll down to "ARTICLE IV: Board of Directors"
  388. Ge0rG > Directors may only be adult natural persons
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  390. MattJ Supernatural beings are excluded
  391. Ge0rG also no bots
  392. antranigv ahh noooo, looks like I can't, being an alien
  393. antranigv anyone know what would be the best use for xmpp.fund?
  394. antranigv I got the domain a year ago now I'm thinking to put a links for all patrion and similar of XMPP server/client applications
  395. antranigv so people can donate
  396. antranigv not sure if I should ask that here, or if there's another channel for that
  397. antranigv s/channel/MUC
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  400. Ge0rG antranigv: jcbrand has created a job portal on https://xmpp.work/ - might be a nice idea to have something similar but for clownfunding
  401. antranigv too bad Dino does not have service discovery for MUCs on servers. I should add that.
  402. antranigv Ge0rG, crowdfunding you mean? :D
  403. Ge0rG antranigv: sure
  404. antranigv yea I'll do that, I'll get in touch
  405. antranigv I still have the feeling that all messengers are going to die but XMPP is gonna stay forever.
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  413. Neustradamus Some people really must update XMPP in Pidgin... - https://sourceforge.net/blog/november-2020-community-choice-project-month-pidgin-im/
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  416. Ge0rG Neustradamus: please do!
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  418. Holger 😳
  419. moparisthebest pidgin project team has an xmpp server?
  420. Holger I guess Pidgin might be a good fit for the remaining *SourceForge* community indeed.
  421. Neustradamus moparisthebest: xmpp:devel@conference.pidgin.im?join
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  423. Holger XMPP is still the first-mentioned protocol on pidgin.im ...
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  425. moparisthebest TIL
  426. flow why does that blog post still mention "Google Talk"…
  427. moparisthebest doesn't google talk still work to talk with other google talk users?
  428. MattJ I /think/ Google is still accepting client connections
  429. Holger Yup.
  430. Zash They do
  431. Ge0rG but no TLS
  432. MattJ Sure?
  433. Holger For c2s there's TLS.
  434. Holger There wasn't for s2s but that's all-dead now anyway.
  435. MattJ There was no TLS on s2s, but they've always had c2s TLS afaik
  436. Ge0rG ah, ok
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  438. MattJ One reason was custom domains... they were part of the discussions about how to allow a domain to be securely delegated to a third-party to run an XMPP service on your behalf without having to send them your cert+key annually
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  446. edhelas Version 1.3.0 of XEP-0118 (User Tune) has been released.
  447. edhelas wow 12 years later :D
  448. jonas’ thank debacle :)
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  495. Ge0rG marc: I've submitted the IBR with token approach as a new proto-XEP at https://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/ibr-token.html and opened a new PR to remove the specifics of it from XEP-0401 at https://gitlab.com/xsf/xeps/-/merge_requests/33
  496. Ge0rG Rendered HTML: https://op-co.de/tmp/xep-0401.html
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  498. Ge0rG marc: it would be super-splendid if you'd review the 0401 changes and give your OK to merge them.
  499. Ge0rG it also renames the XEP to "Ad-hoc Account Invitation Generation"
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  505. MattJ !praise Ge0rG
  506. Ge0rG MattJ: that's a bit premature, isn't it?
  507. Ge0rG There are also some more TODOs remaining in the document, but I hope I can fix them after I've sneaked myself onto the authors list
  508. marc Ge0rG, 1.2 3) optional?
  509. marc Maybe I don't want all the accounts in my roster
  510. marc Also, you sneaked your name into the authors list ;)
  511. Ge0rG marc: well, 1.2 3 is the ultimate goal of inviting somebody, isn't it?
  512. marc I think that's 1.1
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  514. marc If I'm an admin I don't want to have all users in my roster
  515. marc I think that's shouldn't be mandatory
  516. Ge0rG marc: so it should be a parameter for the admin ad-hoc command?
  517. marc Or a server configuration
  518. marc I don't know
  519. Ge0rG Or a site configuration, because you are the admin after all
  520. Ge0rG marc: the new ibr-token comes with a mechanism that doesn't fall back to roster subscription
  521. marc new ibr-token?
  522. Ge0rG Also I'm pretty sure I didn't touch 1.x 3 in the current PR, so please let's stick to reviewing just the changes I did today?
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  524. Ge0rG > marc: I've submitted the IBR with token approach as a new proto-XEP at https://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/ibr-token.html [...]
  525. marc Ge0rG, I see, it's in the current version of 401
  526. marc Hard to diff without diff ;)
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  529. marc Ge0rG, I saw your submission but I don't understand what you mean. Why is there no PARS fallback. I thought you argued hours for PARS fallback
  530. Ge0rG marc: you mean in the new XEP?
  531. marc ‎[19:55:48] ‎Ge0rG‎: marc: the new ibr-token comes with a mechanism that doesn't fall back to roster subscription
  532. marc Not sure what you mean by that
  533. Ge0rG marc: https://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/ibr-token.html#sect-idm45648763902464 and https://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/ibr-token.html#sect-idm45648763899840
  534. Ge0rG marc: those two are explicitly for account registration, not for adding a contact. The PARS fallback is still part of 0401 and not of the new one, which is just the registration via IBR flow
  535. Ge0rG I really don't like splitting a use case over three different XEPs, but I even more dislike everything being stalled
  536. Ge0rG marc: the diff is in the MR btw
  537. marc I didn't even mention PARS, just that the roster subscription shouldn't be mandatory in account creation
  538. Ge0rG https://gitlab.com/xsf/xeps/-/merge_requests/33/diffs?commit_id=9c522069a7d09de58b78ccae19c74bb232323c3c
  539. marc But it's not part of your change
  540. marc I just recognized it while reading your 401 version
  541. Ge0rG marc [20:00]: > Ge0rG, I saw your submission but I don't understand what you mean. Why is there no PARS fallback. I thought you argued hours for PARS fallback > I didn't even mention PARS, just that the roster subscription shouldn't be mandatory in account creation
  542. marc > ‎[19:55:48] ‎Ge0rG‎: marc: the new ibr-token comes with a mechanism that doesn't fall back to roster subscription
  543. marc you brought that up
  544. Ge0rG marc: that's not PARS. You asked about roster subscription being mandatory in 0401, I hinted that it's not in ibr-token
  545. marc I'm totally confsued, too late maybe
  546. Ge0rG Maybe
  547. marc Anyway, looks fine to me
  548. Ge0rG marc: thanks very much!
  549. marc Ge0rG, thanks for your effort
  550. Ge0rG marc: could you please note in either PR that you are okay with the current patch so that jonas’ or another editor can merge?
  551. marc Ge0rG, last time it was okay to agree here
  552. marc IIRC
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  573. jonas’ it is ok, but only if an editor sees it :)
  574. jonas’ and remembers it
  575. jonas’ so it’s better to do it right on the PR/MR for future reference, too
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  578. emus Sorry for interrupt: Hi guus, Openfire Spark is that is a library or server related software?
  579. jonas’ AFAIK that’s a client
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  581. emus ah okay
  582. emus thanks
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  590. Guus emus: Openfire is a server, Spark is a desktop client. See igniterealtime.org
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