-
flow
jcbrand, bonus points if you had put a <note/> with a link to dijkstra's note containing the argument why numbering should start at zero :)
-
jcbrand
flow: I was wondering how to do that
-
jcbrand
I.e. how to add footnotes
-
flow
jcbrand: example at https://github.com/xsf/xeps/blob/master/xep-0373.xml#L247-L253
-
jcbrand
Thanks, done
-
deuill
What's the state-of-the-art for XMPP-to-other-chat transports? Neither Spectrum2 nor Matterbridge are built for XMPP specifically, which means there's guaranteed impedance mismatches as they try to cater to the lowest common denominator.
-
Daniel
Spectrum2 isn't build for xmpp?
-
Ge0rG
Spectrum2 is just horrible
-
Ge0rG
deuill: biboumi is a great irc bridge, and Bifröst is slowly getting better at matrix bridging
-
deuill
Not in the sense that XMPP is the singular source/target abstraction used, and less so by the fact that you're mostly relegated to using libpurple-based connectors.
-
Ge0rG
And libpurple hasn't followed up with xmpp for the last decade
-
deuill
Biboumi is indeed wonderful, and Spectrum2, though terrible, is probably the best thing around...
-
deuill
I realize that chasing after moving targets and working around potential ToS violations and the like make any significant effort here a fool's errand, but Matrix trumpets this idea a lot
-
Ge0rG
I was going to say that matrix also has paid developers working on their bridges, but my experience with Bifröst has been very mixed in that regard
-
SamWhited
I always thought bridging was a bad idea in general, but I can't tell if it's actually part of the reason for Matrix's popularity among the Hacker News crowd or if it's just a thing they like to talk about a lot
-
Daniel
I think there are some dedicated bridges (not multi transport) that work ok
-
SamWhited
That is to say, I'm always unsure if it's something we should focus on or not
-
Daniel
One for IRC and one for whatsapp
-
Daniel
Oh and JMP's SMS bridging seems to work fine
-
Daniel
According to people...
-
Ge0rG
SamWhited: having a commercial quality bridge for some commonly used silo networks would be great, but doesn't have a business model
-
Ge0rG
Also you'll run into getting blacklisted really fast
-
deuill
Ah right, forgot about the WhatsApp one, that's another good example. My understanding is that Matrix-the-project has been sold under this idea of being the one protocol to mesh/replace others from the very start.
-
SamWhited
Actually, that's a fair point, JMP is pretty great. I was using them as my primary phone provider for a while, only switched because I was needing group SMS more and their implementation of that was terrible. Otherwise it was fantastic.
-
Ge0rG
deuill: as was xmpp, twenty years ago
-
Ge0rG
deuill: there are some quotes and links in https://yaxim.org/blog/2019/04/01/yaxim-enters-the-matrix/
-
moparisthebest
SamWhited: jmp has somewhat recently started a group texting beta using that pre muc xep I can't recall right now... Supposedly works well
-
deuill
Right, and that's probably a good way to build up hype until you've reached some critical mass -- I suspect bridging will become less prominent as a goal if the project becomes popular enough, especially given how much work it is to keep everything working.
-
mathieui
moparisthebest, muc-light (or lite I don’t remember) ?
-
moparisthebest
No it's a xep-00xx
-
Daniel
33?
-
moparisthebest
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0033.html yep
-
moparisthebest
Honestly I've never used group SMS but people in the jmp muc seem happy about it
-
moparisthebest
Context: https://wiki.soprani.ca/SGX/GroupMMS + https://github.com/iNPUTmice/Conversations/issues/3844
-
benharri
seeing the phone number instead of the name is pretty jarring but it works well enough
-
deuill
I wonder if bridges might work well for driving client features/XEPs that might otherwise need to wait for genuine support.
-
deuill
For example, message reactions, threading, etc. Though I'm guessing client developers aren't exactly experiencing a dearth of feature reports without this sort of additional pressure.
-
deuill
I guess the XEP-0033 issue above is an example of that.
-
SamWhited
moparisthebest: that was the thing that made me finally leave them actually; it's worse than the implementation they had before because it's not supported by anything. Before at least I could see who sent a message, with that groupchat thing I just see that a MUC with a dozen numbers in the title sent a message and have no idea who anybody ise
-
moparisthebest
Ah, well it's still optional, and someone threatened to write a muc bridge for it
-
SamWhited
yah, I'd waited several years so when they finally got it but it was worse than the original I just decided I couldn't wait several more years for them to use a spec that anything actually supported