this means i need to save every message so i can convert it back to xml
lovetox
for example i dont save the resource from which the message came
lovetox
never had the need for that
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marc
lovetox, okay, good point
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marc
Dino stores that information
marc
lovetox, isn't the id attribute the stanza id?
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Zash
it's not
Zash
maybe it was clearer when it was called archive-id
marc
ah, okay
marc
what's the reason not using the id attribute as uuid?
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Zash
This feels like one of the recurring discussions we have. I'm hoping the reasoning is written down somewhere.
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marc
No, I don't want to discuss this. A pointer to the reason would be enough :D
jonas’
historically, there is no guarantee that the id attribute is sufficiently unique
MattJ
MAM archives need a unique id to reference stored messages. The id attribute is not guaranteed to be present or unique (it is controlled by the sending client)
MattJ
Early versions of XEP-0313 added an element: <archived by='[address of archive]' id='[archive id of message]' />
MattJ
Then it was decided that it would be generally useful if other XEPs could use these guaranteed unique ids as well, so it was split out to stanza-id
MattJ
The id attribute remains useful to the sending client as a way of tracking error responses (kind of), but for long-term unique identifiers, stanza-id is the preferred way to refer to a stanza
MattJ
origin-id was added to the stanza-id XEP as a hacky workaround for certain MUC services that did not preserve the 'id' attribute on messages, but I sense that most people would like to see that to be removed now
Zash
Errors having the same id as the stanza they are an error-reply to makes @id non-unique..
jonas’
true
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Zash
In a backup it would make some sense to stick <stanza-id by="local client full jid" id="whatever primary key of local database"/> in there
Zash
Althoooooo
Zash
You need (@from, @id) for uniqueness in any case, and errors would have @to/@from swapped.
marc
Ah, thanks for the explanation
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New version that generates <stanza-id> elements and omits to/from for the own account: https://paste.centos.org/view/75801e0e
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Ge0rG
Zash [17:16]:
> In a backup it would make some sense to stick <stanza-id by="local client full jid" id="whatever primary key of local database"/> in there
But what if your local database is using auto increment integer?
Zash
What about it?
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Ge0rG
A stanza-id must be globally unique
Zash
Does it?
Zash
It's still scoped by stanza-id/@by, no?
Ge0rG
Oh, right!
Ge0rG
So it doesn't guarantee the one thing it was supposed to fix about @id
Ge0rG
Despite the title
Ge0rG
You had one job, XEP-0359
Zash
> It is RECOMMENDED that the ID generating service uses UUID
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moparisthebest
today I learned something new, that XMPP is a "store and forward" protocol which makes it unsuitable for messaging
moparisthebest
however, Signal *is* suitable for messaging
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moparisthebest
I'm waiting in suspense for the explanation, but I'm guessing it'll never come
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edhelas
moparisthebest we should make XMPP over Signal Protocol then, should solve this problem
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moparisthebest
he responded, many XEPs are in draft and he was in a big company once and the user list made xmpp "fall over"
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moparisthebest
don't get what this has to do with Signal but oh well
moparisthebest
why do I even talk to people on the fediverse lol
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edhelas
time to build a social network on top of XMPP !
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Link Mauve
I remember some xeps.xml file listing every XEP published, do you remember where it is?
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Zash
It got replaced by something with a slightly different format
Zash
xeps-list.xml or somesuch?
Zash
Link Mauve, https://xmpp.org/extensions/xeplist.xml