XSF Discussion - 2021-01-22

Just food for thoughts: With fossdem happening online, might be nice to create some MUC prior to the event start, to help those that wish to do something there to coordinate. (matrix does so and +100 people joined)

> Escribí: > Hi arc, dave (dwd ?), matthew (Wild?), ralphm and Seve - please approve and merge if you are satisfied: https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/871 Good day, are you planning any review/comment and I should wait, or what is the process?

emus, there is potentially no process

emus, commteam is the owner of the website.

Okay

HTTP Upload‽ https://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=15607&cid=2048735

:)

JEP-0129?

Indeed

emus, https://dpaste.org/XbmE -- a heavy edit; feel free to use as little/much as you like 😉

Thank you theTedd, sorry for asking this - are you a native english speaker?

sí

theTedd, thanks!

small correction; https://dpaste.org/a7ex

Okay great. I will put this into the draft tonight and then merge

👍

theTedd - that is a great edit

may I just keep the title 1 and the 2. sub title or is that a heavy mistake/weird expression?

I think they both imply the same thing, so just choose one or the other

The second one is actually finishing the first one in my opinion

it matches with that to repeat the point, yes

yes, that is my intention

"The App Shouldn't Matter" and "Technology Not Apps" are a pair

there's nothing wrong with them grammatically, no

Yes I understand, but I preferred to keep stateing the first half of my though (but also the written statement) then add the second half to finish. So my question was: were my titles technically correct? ✏

okay, then I took almost everything from your review 🙂

Happy to merge tonight!

As I link to the Getting started page, any comments on this: https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/870

"The following links each give you lists of publicly available providers." => "The following links provide lists of publicly available providers."

thanks, will edit later ✏

End of January is actually coming closer and we head for the first release of the XMPP Newletter in 2021. Everyone invited to drop their news until 2nd of Feb. Newsletter on December/January: https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/851 (Go to Files changes/Edit File) Or drop your news text to you online pad: https://yopad.eu/p/xmpp-newsletter-365days 📝☕

The process of updating a protoxep during approval period is just "send a motivated merge request and get an editor to agree", right?

mathieui, No.

mathieui, It's not IPR-controlled by the XSF yet, so really you need to talk to the proposer.

dwd, I mean, as a proposer of course

otherwise yes, that makes sense

Oh! Then yeah!

Thanks!

editors: multiplexing was accepted as XEP-0451 and it's on the website, but it doesn't appear to be in the repo. Did something go wrong with the process?

(/cc jonas’ I think? I never remember who's doing editor stuff these days)

I am

SamWhited, pushed, sorry

thankx

thanks, even

SamWhited, in general, editor@muc.xmpp.org might be the place :)

Then I'd have to join a room I'm not already in ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

And remember what that room is

SamWhited: Know that feeling 😅

There is a lot of room for improvement with xmpp group chat

I do often wish we had something sort of like email where I can send a broadcast without actually joining or receiving replies (unless they're directed directly to me)

Like an email alias or a mailing list that allows writes without joining

The directed to you part is one thing we need to really address

SamWhited: tagging systems like this are lazy, dating back to plain text IRC

arc: tagging systems? I don't think that's a term I've heard before

Taking a message for a specific recipient within a group chat

Tagging

Flagging?

One of the first plugins I wrote for Prosody was a way to send messages to other groups without joining them (porting behavior previously performed by a bot).

So you could write editors: The thing seems to be weird And they could reply with xsf: Fixed, thanks!

oooh, nice, I like that idea as a feature

But can't we do better than that?

MIX?

I mean, how we specify who the message is intended for?

References?

References lets us specify text that should be highlighted or whatever, but we still need the actual feature built on top of it to @mention someone, other rooms on the server, maybe autocomplete, etc.

Whatever that ends up looking like.

I don't actually know if MIX inherited the property of PubSub of publishing being separate from subscriptions.

SamWhited, so, we need implementations? Agree.

Implementations are always the problem

Zash: do we have a feature to implement?

I don't think references really gives us any of that, it just says "you can highlight stuff in the body"

You know for most of us, covid19 plus winter means a ton of alone time inside. Sitting down and just hammering out a bunch of XMPP work on our respective software would be a great use of this time

arc, if only it was that easy, though :x

Why isn't it?

SamWhited, and say that it's type=mention and uri=xmpp:yourjid ?

And then either the client does something or the server does something like https://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/muc-mention-notifications.html

Sounds good to me

I would be happy to grab the Julython code and set it up for, say, March, with participation prices like t-shirts and stuff, classy name and art

arc: that's a fun idea, I love a good hackathon

(I think the XMPP library I make actually started as a hackathon project for HipChat, then got rewritten later on my own time so Atlassian wouldn't own it)

arc, not saying it is a bad idea or anything, but more than anything it’s pretty hard to focus due to all the externalities (depending on how your country handles covid)

This is true. ⤴️

Sure yes. It just seems like we all have these little bouts of energy that usually just fizzles out after we have a discussion about it without much code being written

I've been trying to do more XMPP work on weekends and after work on my day job (and thinking about it a lot when I should be doing my job like right this moment) but there's also just the fact that being in front of a computer all day working on crap I hate makes me desperately not want to continue being in front of a computer even for things I like working on

But if there’s something setup I would be happy to participate anyway, even if I may not do a lot!

You know what, I'm going to write a SCAM proposal for this. Even if it is online only.

(and I am kind of in the same situation as SamWhited)

Having a lot of people in a room working on different things is a good motivator, even if less work gets done in some ways because you're distracted and chatting and what not

"room" being the virtual kind of room, of course

I agree

I get so much more work done at sprints and hackathons than solo focused time.

I end up chatting for most of it and not getting much done, but then I have a ton of ideas from talking to people and am fired up about it so it gets done later

Unless it's a team thing actually, I guess I've gotten a ton done in those now that I think about it

I was very much the opposite for me, I get fired up early in the sprint with talking about this stuff, I usually blast out a lot of work over the second half

This reminds me, there's a hackathon coming up at work. I think I'm going to be slightly self-serving and do some work that's relevant to my day job but is open source in upstream projects I use in my XMPP stuff.

It's a win-win.

What are you doing for work these days?

And catchy name brainstorm?

arc: DHCP/IPAM/DNS stuff. I'd be curious what you're up to these days too, we should catch up out of band.

HaXMPPathon?

(maybe not)

I'm thinking something I could have one of our artists make logos and t-shirt art for

You know I did not get a single conference shirt last year. Not one. I think that's the first in like 20 years

But everyday I drink tea and water out of a hackathon mug that I got from a gnome sprint 5 years ago.

It could be a play on words, like including the word March but using it like walking in formation

Even if that is a bit english-centric

PhalanX March?

Like 'March of freedom'?

Code March?

Trampling down the bugs?

🤣

It would also be handy if the name led easily to ideas for the artist(s) making swag art

ralphm: mattj: Seve: dwd: it's that time again

ohai

It is indeed.

I apologise, I'm on mobile and on a unstable connection, I'll try to follow but can't do much more, sorry :(

ralphm: ?

Well we have quorum but I'm not sure we have an agenda. Dwd have you substitute chaired yet?

I have not, but I am in a meeting that's overrun at work, so I can pay some attention but not enough to chair.

(I mean, the meeting is that we've won a major contract and we're drinking, so...)

Actually I slept through last week's meeting

You got more out of it than we did then.

We really need to get her act together this year 😅

Yes

S/her/our

Sounds like we barely have a quorum, shall we continue or skip? I don't have anything to bring up other than my concern about FOSDEM and (apparent?) lack of SCAM activity

But without anyone representing SCAM a meeting won't fix anything there

Well you're drinking, seve is on a unstable connection, and I don't think any of us have agenda items. I don't see how we could have a meeting

True enough. But we do need to gain some oversight/leadership of SCAM and the summit.

So before I get more than halfway down my pint, we could agree that.

Agreed to that

Who has time and cycles amongst us to do that?

Nobody :P (which is probably similar for SCAM I assume)

I can try and do some poking this week

But I'm the worst option if there is anyone else with more time

I know from a different organization that I'm with that Fosdem really needs our details like last week.

Yes, true. It'd be great to just get an idea of what's happening, if nothign else. Can we at least commit to discuss on list?

I don't even know if we applied for or received a stand

Me neither.

We, as in board or scam?

arc, Yes.

The board did nothing, we agreed to let SCAM handle it

We as a board already decided to send Fosdem to scam.

(as is usual)

Did SCAM know we did?

That was another week that we're off wasn't here

I don't even know who is a member of scam anymore

But then Ralph said that he was going to take care of it, I think?

IDK I have only been to Fosdem once, and only because Google paid for my trip. It's even harder now from the west coast US

https://fosdem.org/2021/news/2020-12-11-stands-cfp/ > The deadline is the 25th of December.

I'll post to the list

Sounds lik a sensible first step.

Thank you

I would like to invite everyone to take a little review if there are any branches that can be deleted: https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/branches

I removed a few already 🚮️ but Im not entirely sure for all of the left ones

Closed + merged are probably fine to drop

Yes I thought so

Newsletter branches from 2019 can probably go too, why are they even there?

dependabot?

because they got never merged as this, but you need to ask the authors from that time

no clue

https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0379.html#general_idea I just noted that the coloring on this schema is pretty funny

funky

emus, how long does it take for a blog post to appear on the website?

zash?

iteam?

(I have no issues if it takes time, I was just surprised to not see it on the blog yet)

Is it merged? Is the build complete? Then I think at midnight.

If anyone has opinions on how to configure the update cronjob then I'm all ears.

nah, I’m good

if I understand it properly, building the website is a bit tricky and pelican is not very happy with our usage

Don't forget Docker

and Docker hub rate limits

an angry bird.

IIRC it's currently set to some time in the morning, some time early in the evening and midnight

In which timezone ... is anyones guess.

Better than no automation at all and hoping someone from iteam is awake I hope.

yeah, it’s not like the website is evolving fast enough to justify doing it more often

I’m just comparing to my own blog deployment (with pelican too) which takes 5 seconds after the push :p

(but I have neither a complex website nor a real need for isolation)

My own is instant, but then I push directly to production ;)

...and build in produciton

I did that at some point so I will not judge you

Build on push to production, in production. WCGW

Nothing, that's what, it's perfect. Also my personal website, I'll survive without it.

Ok I think it's UTC, so +4h

Can poke it if anyone feels strongly that now is a better time to publish

thanks for replying

Link Mauve, is the code (layout+css) for https://linkmauve.fr/software/clients.html published somewhere?

wurstsalat, https://git.linkmauve.fr/xmpp-doap.git probably (although I do not know how up-to-date that is)

mathieui, that’s not including this page afaict

wurstsalat, my understanding is that this goes on top of the already built website