XSF Discussion - 2021-05-23


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  197. Wuuko Hey
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  200. Wuuko Why this channel is no encrypted
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  204. Wuuko Why this channel is no encrypted
  205. Menel Because it its a public channel
  206. croax Only upper brain2brain encryption ;-)
  207. eevvoor public chats are not encrypted. Wuuko
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  210. Wuuko Ok. Thanks.
  211. Menel There are even public logs https://logs.xmpp.org/xsf/
  212. qrpnxz shh, don't tell the hackers, this chat is not encrypted.
  213. qrpnxz :)
  214. Menel Oh, the logs are even with join/leave.. > marc has left "" > 03:02:35 > marc has joined "" > 03:03:00 > marc has left "" > 03:03:16 > marc has joined "" > 03:03:42 > marc has left "" > 03:03:58 > marc has joined "" > 03:04:14 > mukt2 has left "" > 03:04:35 > marc has left "" > 03:04:50 > marc has joined "" > 03:05:25 > marc has left "" > 03:07:27 > marc has joined "" > 03:08:16 > marc has left "" > 03:08:34 > marc has joined "" > 03:09:05 > marc has left "" > 03:13:53 > marc has joined "" > 03:14:33 > marc has left "" > 03:14:50 > marc has joined "" > 03:15:38 > marc has left "" > 03:18:02 > marc has joined "" > 03:18:38 > marc has left "" > 03:18:52 > marc has joined "" > 03:19:45 > marc has left "" > 03:19:56 > marc has joined "" > 03:20:34 > marc has left "" > 03:20:44 > marc has joined "" > 03:21:23 > marc has left
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  216. Menel Etc
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  218. eevvoor yes it is a data desaster Menel
  219. eevvoor I always planned to use a separate JID due to that but I am too lazy.
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  223. Menel What's the desaster?
  224. eevvoor That it is online when you switch on and off your computer.
  225. Menel Ah.
  226. Menel But the jid is not logged, only your nic. You can set a different one in each room
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  271. marc Strange, must be a Gajim problem :)
  272. wurstsalat marc: must it?
  273. marc I think so, I see that Gajim reconnects quite often on large group chats
  274. marc Probably a timeout or something like that
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  276. qrpnxz gajim can barely cope with having #libera@irc.libera.chat open unless i always keep it maximized and look into it frequently. No, idk wtf.
  277. qrpnxz gajim can barely cope with having #libera%irc.libera.chat open unless i always keep it maximized and look into it frequently. No, idk wtf.
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  291. Wuuko Matrix and XMPP which one is better?
  292. qrpnxz xmpp
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  295. Wuuko Why?
  296. Wuuko Not to mention the others.(Session, Signal etc.
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  298. qrpnxz it's well defined and not as centralized. See i don't wanna go into it, but here is one opinion https://wiki.404.city/en/XMPP_vs_Matrix
  299. Wuuko Matrix is also not central
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  301. qrpnxz "not as"
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  303. Wuuko How?
  304. wurstsalat marc, might as well be a server issue. logs would help! you're welcome to join gajim's chat
  305. qrpnxz Wuuko, see the link
  306. Wuuko Is XMPP an ios?
  307. qrpnxz i think so. I don't use apple.
  308. flow Wuuko, yep, but the quality of the implementions varies
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  310. flow but i've heard positive news latetely about Monal, one of the XMPP clients for iOS
  311. qrpnxz looks alright
  312. Wuuko Is encryption turned on?
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  315. qrpnxz i believe monal supports omemo e2ee yes
  316. Wuuko Good :)
  317. Wuuko Now matrix has got 28m user and 60k server
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  330. mathieui Wuuko: you do realize the incongruity of coming in a room mostly dedicated to XMPP and asking "XMPP or matrix, what is better?", right?
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  332. mathieui Which is ripe for inflamatory discourse, obviously
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  334. Wuuko > mathieui wrote: > Wuuko: you do realize the incongruity of coming in a room mostly dedicated to XMPP and asking "XMPP or matrix, what is better?", right? Sorry. Ok.
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  339. Wuuko I like it XMPP
  340. mathieui (I don't have an issue with matrix per se, though wish they did not feel like reinventing the wheel, but I am absolutely repulsed by the agressive marketing of both representatives and fanatic users)
  341. Wuuko Can I set up a server with an old laptop
  342. Wuuko > mathieui wrote: > (I don't have an issue with matrix per se, though wish they did not feel like reinventing the wheel, but I am absolutely repulsed by the agressive marketing of both representatives and fanatic users) I understand
  343. emus Wuuko: I think what mathieui wanted to say, is that likely few here would advocate for Matrix, for some reasons. If you need a tabular comparision, take a look at this table: https://www.messenger-matrix.de/messenger-matrix-en.html
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  346. emus Wuuko: Why do you want to setup a server yourself (immediately)?
  347. mathieui I'm not saying you should not ask the question, just saying that the results may not necessarily be very interesting to you 😉
  348. Wuuko > emus wrote: > Wuuko: Why do you want to setup a server yourself (immediately)?To make it safer
  349. emus mathieui: hehe ok
  350. Menel A xmpp Server can run on basically everything. Its extremely lightweight
  351. Wuuko Menel: for example old laptop?
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  353. Menel Yes
  354. Menel Raspberry pi one, no problem
  355. emus Wuuko: To make what safer? your communication? there a lot of well maintained servers with public registration
  356. Menel I suppose smart watch would work too
  357. Wuuko emus: Yes communication, for example, which server
  358. Wuuko But he'll see ip
  359. wurstsalat hosting your own is not necessarily safer
  360. Wuuko wurstsalat: why?
  361. Wuuko XMPP doesn't mean anything so
  362. Wuuko They'll see ip
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  375. emus Wuuko: I recommend to go with a server maintainted for a while rather than trying yourself. there are many lists showing some. you can even pay for professional xmpp hosting for rather low cost
  376. Menel I don't know... https://snikket.org/ as a server should be fine
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  379. emus MattJ: public registration work here?
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  390. Wuuko > emus wrote: > Wuuko: I recommend to go with a server maintainted for a while rather than trying yourself. there are many lists showing some. you can even pay for professional xmpp hosting for rather low cost Already ı will create server 1 year later
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  398. qrpnxz >you do realize the incongruity of coming in a room mostly dedicated to XMPP and asking "XMPP or matrix, what is better?", right? mathieui, you rather they only go to a matrix channel to ask? lol
  399. qrpnxz emus, why not recommend self-hosting? That's kind of the epic part of federated protocols, and with smth like prosody it's super easy.
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  401. mathieui qrpnxz: just saying that it is probably not the best formulation to get relevant information
  402. Wuuko qrpnxz: yes, own server is best.
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  408. eevvoor I would also recommend selfhosting ...
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  413. Wuuko Where is the all of XMPP server list?
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  415. eevvoor this does not exist
  416. mdosch I wouldn't recommend it to everyone.
  417. eevvoor nobody can know all xmpp servers Wuuko
  418. eevvoor mdosch, yes not for everyone of course
  419. Wuuko Do you have any
  420. Wuuko Do you have any The List
  421. eevvoor But you learn a lot and you do not need to run it permanently ...
  422. mdosch Wuuko: > Where is the all of XMPP server list? You can scan the net on port 5269 or so with shodan.
  423. eevvoor Wuuko, a good list is maintained by emus and melvo, sry I forgot the link, but they can provide it.
  424. Wuuko I lost link, too.
  425. Wuuko Can I change servers now?
  426. qrpnxz Wuuko, here is *a* list https://xmpp-servers.404.city/
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  428. qrpnxz mdosch, lmao bro
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  430. Wuuko Thanks
  431. mdosch qrpnxz: Afaik MattJ did something like that to guess how many prosodys are around.
  432. Wuuko İs jitsi use XMMP?
  433. mdosch Yes
  434. mdosch > İ You're from Turkey?
  435. Wuuko > mdosch wrote: > You're from Turkey? Yes
  436. Wuuko https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org İs this source code?
  437. mdosch For the website, yes.
  438. mdosch But that's probably not useful for you.
  439. Wuuko Where are the codes of the protocol
  440. mdosch What are you looking for there?
  441. qrpnxz Wuuko, here you go https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6120
  442. mdosch There are specifications for the protocol and there is code for server and client implementations of the protocol.
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  444. mdosch If you want to look at xmpp server code search for ejabberd or prosody.
  445. Wuuko > mdosch wrote: > If you want to look at xmpp server code search for ejabberd or prosody. No only protocol
  446. emus https://wiki.xmpp.org/web/XMPP_Hosting_Providers https://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Provider_Recommendations https://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Provider_Recommendations https://list.jabber.at/ https://invent.kde.org/melvo/xmpp-providers
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  448. emus Wuuko: ^
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  452. Wuuko Which one protocol?
  453. Wuuko It's interesting that the protocol isn't in the spotlight.
  454. mdosch Wuuko, qrpnxz gave you a link to a protocol spec.
  455. Sam Wuuko: the protocol is defined by lots of documents, starting with https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6120
  456. mdosch There are also many extensions, called xeps.
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  458. qrpnxz and here you find links to basically all specs https://xmpp.org/extensions/
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  461. Wuuko So XMPP is fuly open source?
  462. qrpnxz anyone can read and implement the spec
  463. mdosch Wuuko: It's an open protocol. Implementations can be open or closed source.
  464. Wuuko > mdosch wrote: > Wuuko: It's an open protocol. Implementations can be open or closed source. Ok
  465. mdosch I think you don't get the difference between protocol/spec and implementations/code
  466. Wuuko Maybe
  467. Menel Its like all Email Clients and Servers can interoperate. But of course you have different server and client software's
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  477. Wuuko Looks like xmpp is safe
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  486. Wuuko I need to find a reliable server.
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  488. eevvoor Wuuko, XMPP is fully open source, yes, it is even FLOSS.
  489. Wuuko :)
  490. eevvoor You can look into the code for differnet clients and for different servers.
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  492. eevvoor ejabberd and prosody are two well known and reliable xmpp server implemenations.
  493. eevvoor You can install such a server or look into its source code and also edit and thus change it, Wuuko.
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  501. Sam qrpnxz: you said you were writing a server, is that online anywhere?
  502. qrpnxz no, I'm still writing it
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  505. qrpnxz i can let you know when i have Core if you want
  506. qrpnxz Sam,
  507. Sam That'd be great, thanks
  508. emus > mdosch escribió: > I think you don't get the difference between protocol/spec and implementations/code I think Im gonna take this note into a presentation Im preparing
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  845. şişio > I wrote: > What are the metadata in the hands of the server owner ?
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  851. şişio > Sam wrote: > Wuuko: the protocol is defined by lots of documents, starting with https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6120 All protocol code is this, right?
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  857. Menel Thats the core.. The rest is here https://xmpp.org/extensions/
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