XSF Discussion - 2021-09-21


  1. wurstsalat

    Wouldn't it be nicer to have an overview page at https://xmpp.org/rfcs which would list and describe relevant (XMPP) RFCs, and link individual RFC documents to datatracker.ietf.org instead? This would surely minimize maintenance effort and improve presentation of RFCs.

  2. wurstsalat

    Relevant issue https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/issues/414

  3. MattJ

    It certainly would

  4. Ge0rG

    oh yes

  5. Ge0rG

    https://xmpp.org/extensions/ does link to the RFCs, but not any more to our nice and fancy XEP-style rendering

  6. Ge0rG

    Why did you take that away from us?

  7. Ge0rG

    https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc6120.html is eye cancer and an accessibility nightmare

  8. jonas’

    ITYM the worst RFC rendering to-date :-X

  9. Ge0rG

    jonas’: you are using your browser wrong.

  10. jonas’

    I saw that terrible rendering on some IETF pages too in the past, but I always try to get away from that as fast as possible.

  11. Ge0rG

    unless you are also talking about the official rendering being the worst

  12. jonas’

    oh, no, that one's (to be clear: https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc6120.html) the most readable rendering of RFCs I've seen so far.

  13. wurstsalat

    MattJ: would it be okay to provide /rfcs from hugo?

  14. Ge0rG

    jonas’: so you never tried to read RFCs on a mobile device.

  15. jonas’

    Ge0rG, I see the drawbacks, but the rendering of the XSF had terrible <hr/> between sections and a way too small font size. It was all around ugly. I would've fixed that, but nobody could tell me how to re-render the RFCs, so I never did.

  16. MattJ

    wurstsalat, yes, I don't see why not. But there are a bunch there - as long as they are all still accessible easily, it doesn't really matter how we serve them

  17. jonas’

    https://uc.xmpp.zombofant.net/e6a86707-0244-41ed-a18e-c0d288be27ad/LmPKWnpET4-848SPFf6Bag.jpg

  18. Ge0rG

    Sigh. I give up.

  19. jonas’

    Ge0rG, more productive would be to find a way to re-render the RFCs.

  20. Ge0rG

    jonas’: I presume it's based on some rfc xml v1 syntax converter or somesuch.

  21. Zash

    From source xml we no longer have?

  22. jonas’

    I'm sure the XML is available from the IETF tools

  23. Ge0rG

    generator="xml2rfc v1.36 (http://xml.resource.org/)"

  24. Ge0rG

    like this one? https://xmpp.org/rfcs/rfc6120.xml

  25. wurstsalat

    MattJ: accessible as in "this link still resolves: https://xmpp.org/rfcs/rfc6122.html " or accessible by clicking a link at /rfcs ? My idea was to replace these self-hosted ones with ietf-hosted ones (?)

  26. MattJ

    Oh I see

  27. MattJ

    I much prefer our rendering :)

  28. MattJ

    I use it all the time

  29. Ge0rG

    I'm with MattJ here. You can't replace text reflow with anything.

  30. Ge0rG

    The IETF-rendering gives me the choice between unreadable font size and constant horizontal scrolling, so I just don't

  31. Zash

    https://cerdale.zash.se/s/rQTPrSlUEe0IcGAA/b3p_rdtgRTGBElmbFp4Szg.jpg

  32. jonas’

    https://uc.xmpp.zombofant.net/2c985f37-94fa-4be1-8e65-ebbe88d5eadd/7AEoEbK8SnWPbBkRqt3uLA.jpg

  33. jonas’

    Ge0rG, you were saying unreadable font size?

  34. Zash

    https://cerdale.zash.se/s/8BjeoqvC2ABVpBQb/D90QZ3EXT3axww8xDzIfrg.jpg

  35. Zash

    Fennec does a decent job, TIL

  36. jonas’

    my screenshot was with fennec :/

  37. Zash

    If only it didn't do like 2fps

  38. Ge0rG

    jonas’: should I guide you through the font size settings in fennec?

  39. jonas’

    Ge0rG, no, *all* other pages are fine.

  40. wurstsalat

    Just now I see there even is an index file in /rfcs https://xmpp.org/rfcs/index.shtml Maybe I'll start by building a hugo page which replaces that index, then add further (non xmpp.org hosted RCFs)

  41. jonas’

    it's just our broken rendering

  42. Ge0rG

    jonas’: BTW, you can use "reader mode" of fennec for our rendering, but not for the IETF rendering

  43. jonas’

    I don't trust reader mode anymore. It drops content sometimes.

  44. MattJ

    wurstsalat, right, that's what I thought you meant at first, sorry :)

  45. MattJ

    The directory listing is functional, but it could be better

  46. Ge0rG

    jonas’: so fixing our font size will be 10 times better than dropping our rendering

  47. jonas’

    Ge0rG, and then removing the <hr/>.

  48. Ge0rG

    wurstsalat: that's a great idea

  49. jonas’

    Ge0rG, and, yes.

  50. jonas’

    I looked into that though, IIRC, and it was all px based or some similar terror

  51. jonas’

    and then I closed it.

  52. Ge0rG

    jonas’: well, if it makes your eyes bleed, then remove it :)

  53. Zash

    All that meta tag that fixes all mobile issues?

  54. wurstsalat

    Re-rendering RFCs for xmpp.org would also offer to update their life cycle ;) 6122 for example https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/issues/382 I guess this concerns multiple RFCs on xmpp.org

  55. Link Mauve

    THis would also make https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/947 obsolete.

  56. Link Mauve

    I only made this PR because my previous attempts at figuring our RFC rendering process all ended up in failure.

  57. wurstsalat

    maybe there could be both: linking to datatracker.ietf.org in all content pages on xmpp.org (readers can choose how they like to read: txt, html, pdf, etc), and then have xmpp.org/rfcs with a nice index page linking both xmpp.org hosted RFCs and ietf versions. this way we could keep the xmpp.org hosted RFC renderings for convenient reading, but also link to the up to date RFCs at ietf.org

  58. wurstsalat

    Or even better, make all content RFC links link to the new page at xmpp.org/rfcs#anchor

  59. emus

    I like this suggestion

  60. mjk

    jonas’: > Merged #1106 into master. Yaay.

  61. wurstsalat

    https://spacecloud.one/upload/186caa17-bb7d-4ef8-88c9-c2ed149963e2/rfcs-1.png

  62. wurstsalat

    my first attempt. suggestions?

  63. emus

    Really nice!!!

  64. wurstsalat

    both ietf.org and (if they exist) xmpp.org versions are shown

  65. Zash

    👌

  66. wurstsalat

    should this list _all_ xmpp related RFCs ? there are quite a lot, I learned

  67. Link Mauve

    That would be much better than the current situation, where only some of them are listed. ^^

  68. emus

    I am fine when it can be sorted and filtered somehow maybe. bit I am also fine to list all that are related. Becaude well thats it

  69. emus

    I am fine when it can be sorted and filtered somehow maybe. bit I am also fine to list all that are related. Because well thats it

  70. Zash

    You don't have to do everything at once 🙂

  71. emus

    It is an awesome attempt of you Daniel! 😍

  72. Zash

    But you're not the only one not aware of all RFCs, so seems of value to have such an overview

  73. emus

    maybe we can have the overview first and then link to a sorted page with all of it?

  74. wurstsalat

    well, filtering and sorting is not possible at the moment. but each RFC has an anchor by which it can be linked: xmpp.org/rfcs#6122 would navigate directly to that specific RFC including summary and further links

  75. wurstsalat

    we could use those on content pages elsewhere on xmpp.org

  76. Zash

    Interesting

  77. emus

    wurstsalat: whats the issue?