how about something client enforced where clients can choose to display late corrections more explicitly?
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jonasβ
fwiw, I think that neither a hard number of messages nor a hard time limit for corrections is ok and this will be something which needs to be figured out in a modernxmpp-like venue, or even in individual (closed) deployments
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MattJ
(I'm inclined to agree)
MattJ
i.e. this is a product-level consideration, not a protocol-level one :)
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Ge0rG
Can we remove all occurences of the word "Last" from the XEP then?
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flow
Modyfing arbitrary messages shouldn't be a problem as long as the client makes any modified previous message clear and allows to access and the modifciation history
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Holger
I can imagine things becoming tricky if you receive corrections referencing messages not in your local history?
Holger
But that's just (client) implementation issues I guess π
Holger
Product-level!
Zash
Isn't that one of the reasons MAM grew a way to query individual messages by archive-id?
Holger
Doesn't LMC reference one of the other IDs?
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Zash
Aw π
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arc
Do we have a quorum today?
Zash
The recurring question
arc
Yep.
arc
Given there's no response from another board member I'm guessing not
Zash
ping ralphm, MattJ and dwd?
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ralphmbangs gavel
0. Welcome
Who do we have?
ralphm
Hi!
arc
Here
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Ellenor Malik
Do board meetings have spectator seats?
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ralphm
Sure
Kev
You have one.
ralphm
Everyone in this room may interact, it doesn't require membership
ralphm
That said, we're waiting to reach quorum on directors.
ralphm
MattJ and dwd, ping?
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dwd
Hiya.
ralphm
there we go
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ralphm
Ok. There's a message from Sam on an application for fiscal hosting
ralphm
Anything else we should discuss today?
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Sam
also the pr following up on fiscal host criteria
ralphm
Thanks Sam
ralphm
1. Minute taker
arc
Is it you this week?
ralphm
Could be. I'll take it
ralphm
2. Fiscal host criteria
arc
I think it was Matt last time
ralphm
https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/987/files
MattJ
Hey
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ralphm
The only hangup I had was on the word sponsee. I've seen sponsoree, too, but English is not my native language and I'm out of dept here
MattJ
I'm in favour of the PR, except for a couple of editorial fixes (that being one of them)
Kev
FWIW, Sponsee isn't a word in English, although it's obvious to a native speaker what it means.
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ralphm
Kev: cool. What's the right word?
dwd
There's no single word.
Kev
I'm not actually sure there is one.
dwd
Sponsor subject?
Kev
"Sponsored Project" would be what I'd probably write.
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dwd
That too.
Sam
sponsee is definitely a word
ralphm
Ok. MattJ, can you handle the editorial fixes then?
ralphmmoves to approve
ralphm
+1
Kev
Sam: I'm not convinced - https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sponsee
(But dropping it now)
dwd
It'd only be a word if Sponser was...
arc
Leave it to the Brit to be a linguistic prescriptionist
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arc
π
ralphm
I could not care less by now
ralphm
MattJ: can you pick this up?
ralphm
also awaiting votes
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arc
+1
MattJ
+1, though if someone else can then it will move quicker
MattJ
I'm away for the next few days at least
dwd
+1
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ralphm
Motion carries.
ralphm
I'll add comments to the PR and have it resolved
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ralphm
3. First applicant
ralphm
So, first off, since this PR isn't done yet, I'm not sure that a) it is fair to assume applicant has agreed, b) given Sam's comments the application will pass. I think we have to review the application against the approved rules.
ralphm
Opinions
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dwd
I'm missing context, I'm afraid.
ralphm
dwd: there was an e-mail to the Board list, on October 1, with a follow-up on October 8.
MattJ
The only issue I recall is that they don't have any open-source code, currently
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Sam
The Open Source Collective requires you to have source code available before they'll consider you, but that does seem like it would make it impossible to fundraise and then pay someone to write code, which also seems desirable and may be the case here.
Sam
I assume (but don't know for sure) that the reason for that rule is to stop tons of random people from applying and wasting resources because they just had an idea that they'll never execute
dwd
So... Yes. The problem as I see it is that this isn't an existing project wanting to raise funds.
Sam
Anyways, may be something for the board to balance/decide.
MattJ
Personally I'd settle for some documentation of the planned implementation
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MattJ
and an agreement of course that it will be open-source
dwd
I can't quite get my head around how this works. We'd get some donations toward this, and then... What? They go out and find a contractor to write it? This feels more like a bounty type thing.
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MattJ
It basically is
MattJ
Though they already have someone (some people?) who will work on it, given the funding
dwd
I'm not against a bounty type thing. Just not sure if this is the right vehicle, as it stands. It might be better to have the XSF simply handle bounty arrangements itself. Perhaps.
Sam
They already have a person who works on the matrix/xmpp bridge, I think
MattJ
FWIW the ultimate goal of the project is to add support for MAM to xmpp.js so it can be used in the Matrix<->XMPP bridge
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dwd
Right, I get that.
MattJ
But I've seen little in the way of docs to give me confidence that the project is anywhere near scoped out
dwd
Well, is that our problem?
MattJ
and who will be involved, etc.
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dwd
Genuine question, by the way. I don't know.
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Kev
Sorry, I realise I'm out of this, but does this mean someone is asking the XMPP to handle sponsorship for xmpp.js work, and that someone isn't xmpp.js? That seems a bit weird if so.✎
MattJ
For an existing open-source project, I think all these questions have clearer answers
Kev
Sorry, I realise I'm out of this, but does this mean someone is asking the XSF to handle sponsorship for xmpp.js work, and that someone isn't xmpp.js? That seems a bit weird if so. ✏
MattJ
Kev, yeeees. It's weird or not weird, depending on how you look at it. Maybe the plugin will or won't be upstreamed, but these people are not affiliated with xmpp.js maintainers as far as I am aware.
MattJ
If it's all open-source, I don't think that's a real problem. They could just as easily fork xmpp.js with a click of a button if that's what it takes to get approved.
MattJ
They're not applying as xmpp.js
arc
I think it is pretty clear
MattJ
They essentially want to do crowdfunding for a specific short-term project, and they want us to accept and hold the funds for them
ralphm
Ok. Either we resolve this now by vote, or we need more discussion.
MattJ
If we decide it needs more discussion we should identify what specific blocking points are, and communicate these to the applicants if necessary
ralphmmotions we approve the project Message Archive Management ( MAM ) plugin
dwd
I think I think it's just weird. But not necessarily bad weird.
ralphm
Note that -1 is fine too, but I want to move on
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ralphm
dwd, MattJ, arc?
MattJ
-1, as it currently stands. Given that it's not an established project, I think I want to see more details before we accept it as one.
dwd
I see Matt is typing furiously, so I'm waiting to see what he says...
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dwd
Oh. Colour me surprised.
ralphm
Ah, for some reason Gajim doesn't show me
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ralphm
I don't know how we communicate this feedback, but MattJ, given that you object, please take care of this. I know you're going away for a few days, but after that, if needed.
ralphm
4. AOB
ralphm
Any?
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MattJ
Yes, I can communicate with them next week
dwd
I have no decision in mind, but every objection I have really seems to be answered by Matt's comments. So I guess +1?
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arc
+1 from me btw
Sam
MattJ: if you send me your Open Collective account (if you have one) I can add you so you can communicate with them on there
ralphm
+1
MattJ
Shall do
ralphm
Cool
ralphm
5. Date of Next
ralphm
+1W
ralphm
6. Close
ralphm
Thanks all!
ralphmbangs gavel
Sam
Thanks all; I really appreciate you taking this on
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Zash
Editor-ial question: What's the deal with https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0030.html being Version 2.5rc3 ? (release candidate?)
jonasβ
don't ask me
jonasβ
2017 was before my time
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jonasβ
(as editor)
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Zash
Anyone happen to have a tool that compares a DOAP file with the latest XEP versions, highlighting which ones have been updated?
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emus
wurstsalat:
emus
I think it would be great to render this as comparision between clients
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Zash
Hello 500 character bash "one-liner"
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wurstsalat
I don't have that one-liner ;)
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Zash
https://paste.debian.net/1216303/ split across 3 lines for the absolutely tiniest increase in readability