XSF Discussion - 2021-12-07


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  442. coolio Good afternoon
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  446. coolio 😊
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  693. Guus To me, most pages on the website seem slightly off-center (to the left). Is that just me?
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  697. wurstsalat Guus, now that you mention it.. the brand logo on my monitor does not align with the page (and that's centered)
  698. MattJ Guus: tried adjusting your horizontal sync on your CRT?
  699. Guus har har
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  701. Guus I'm not a web developer, but if I highlight some sections, then each section seems to be "OK". The right-hand sidebar is not filled fully, which leaves a lot of whitespace, which makes thing appear as if they're out of center, I think.
  702. Guus https://igniterealtime.org:443/httpfileupload/rOTFXL0c-bSzAQYa1wMN8lGkXLU/image.png
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  705. Guus I'm unsure if this needs fixing, and if it does, how that is done. I thought I'd mention in the hopes that an actual capable webdeveloper (basically - anyone but me) has an idea. 🙂
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  708. wurstsalat Guus, I found some things which could be improved. I'll have a look this evening :)
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  713. Guus Most excellent 👍
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  843. Zash Observation: In e.g. pubsub disco#items listings, the jid of the pubsub service gets repeated a lot. E.g. as in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html#example-10 Feels ... redundant somehow. The 'jid' attr is MUST per '30 tho.
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  864. flow compress it!
  865. Zash Compression + encryption bad, remember? 😕
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  869. flow yes, I remember the discussion, I still think compression at least individual stanzas isn't harmful and would help in this case a lot
  870. flow yes, I remember the discussion, I still think compressiing at least individual stanzas isn't harmful and would help in this case a lot
  871. flow yes, I remember the discussion, I still think compressing at least individual stanzas isn't harmful and would help in this case a lot
  872. Zash and I think we either need to be sure *all* implementations switch to the safe way, or introduce a new compression mechanism that has very strong words about safety
  873. Zash also not all that excited about the additional memory usage compression needs
  874. flow I am sure those can be allowed to turn compression off
  875. flow It's not like you have to enforce compression on ppl :)
  876. Daniel exi to the rescue
  877. Zash to continue repeating points from the last time we did this, fixed dictionary compression!
  878. Zash Daniel, got implementation?
  879. Daniel no. i just wanted to make sure we brought up all the arguments from last time again
  880. flow Zash, got money?
  881. Zash Daniel, 👍️
  882. flow hmm how positive are we that we already brought up all the arguments? :)
  883. Daniel Zash, I actually looked into fixed dictionary compression for a few hours and it has been unclear to me what libraries/tools actually support this
  884. Daniel it looks like you can give zstd a starting dictionary. but emphasis on the starting
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  886. Zash I thought zstd supported a fixed dictionary
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  888. Daniel i don’t know. my google search and reading docs didn’t bring anything up.
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  896. Ge0rG just have per JID dictionaries, and use some outer container format to distinguish by JID... maybe XML?
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  898. Ge0rG Or what about HTTP/3, it has streams!
  899. Zash Stream per JID pair?
  900. Zash Dreams of SCTP?
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  902. Zash You could also do something like FunXMPP... except also writing it down in a XEP.
  903. Zash \1 → <message, \2 → <presence etc
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  905. Ge0rG Daniel already suggested EXI, so...
  906. Daniel ejabberd has something like this for database compression iirc
  907. Zash Yeah, I heard of that.
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  1023. theTedd concerning zstd: you can start with a fixed dictionary, and set a max size for the dictionary (and if that max size happens to be the size of your starting dictionary...)
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  1027. theTedd that said, I don't feel compression per stanza offers full protection from the types of inspection attacks which are weaknesses for compression+encryption, though I have no proof either way
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  1029. Zash so, trade-off?
  1030. theTedd I have a half-finished compact xml representation scheme using a semi-fixed dictionary (only server can update) and forbids adding security related tokens to the dictionary; to be finished Someday™
  1031. theTedd trade-off what?
  1032. Zash compression ratio/efficiency vs security protection
  1033. theTedd I think security is either yes or no
  1034. Zash I think It Depends™
  1035. Kev I'll choose 'yes', please.
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  1037. theTedd the problem with naively compressing streams is that you don't have the option of not including security tokens in the compressed data - which is how most of the attacks work
  1038. theTedd but an immutable fixed dictionary should avoid that
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  1052. Daniel > concerning zstd: you can start with a fixed dictionary, and set a max size for the dictionary (and if that max size happens to be the size of your starting dictionary. is there a chance that this will still mutate the dict though? theTedd
  1053. theTedd I honestly don't know, but I presume it wouldn't as that would almost certainly change the size
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  1056. theTedd but I see you mean substituting entries, so I'm not sure, but I think not
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  1058. Daniel right. yes I considered this 'hack' after reading the doc. but i wasn’t sure if anyone ever does this. or if it is somewhat supposed to work like this
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  1060. Daniel > but I see you mean substituting entries, so I'm not sure, but I think not yes that's what i meant
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  1068. Zash Given that the docs talk about both a dictionary method and a prefix method, I would think the prefix method would be what you might call a mutable dictionary
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  1700. lovetox hm can i revoke my last call feedback :D?
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  1709. Zash Email a XEP-0424 payload!
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  1714. lovetox hehe
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  1884. edhelas Would it be interesting to hava a XEP to "list and count" the accesses of a Pubsub item to its author ?
  1885. edhelas by basically saving each JID that requested it
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  1887. moparisthebest edhelas, are you working for google analytics now? :P
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  1890. edhelas https://i.imgflip.com/2tfsx4.jpg
  1891. Zash or do you want to implement addictive dopamine producing features?
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  1893. edhelas it's not for me, it's for my friend Mark
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  1907. moparisthebest Zash, I'd just like to say I have equal parts hate and respect for your U+0040 / U+002E jid encoding on your membership application
  1908. emus Until when I have to vote again?
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  1910. moparisthebest emus, do you mean when does voting end? up to and including the meeting on Dec 14th @ 19:00 UTC
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  1912. emus 👍️ thx
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  1914. moparisthebest stupid bylaw question because I'm interested, what happens if the 2 recently re-elected council members who are up for a membership vote now aren't voted back in as members? kicked off council ?
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  1917. Kev Nobody knows.
  1918. moparisthebest ooh a mystery
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  1927. Menel > If a Council member resigns his or her membership in the Corporation, is removed from membership in the Corporation, or is terminated from membership in the Corporation, he or she shall thereby relinquish all rights and responsibilities as a member of the Council. In addition, a Council member may be involuntarily removed from the Council by an affirmative vote of two-thirds (2/3) of the members of the Council. The Council shall at its discretion determine whether to fill any vacancies on the Council caused by resignation or removal of an existing Council member. https://xmpp.org/about/xsf/bylaws/
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  1931. MattJ Now we know!
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  1933. Kev I have no idea how I missed that.
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  1936. Menel I'm not good enough in English and in the ways if xsf to know if thats sarcastic, but I think its clear one can't be in the council if not a member right?
  1937. Zash Do the Bylaws by chance share authors with XEP-0045 or XEP-0060?
  1938. Zash Or is their affliction contagious somehow and has now spread to the Bylaws?
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  1943. Menel I once read a fantasy, where the evil force has the ability to change every written text and memory of an incident, so over time everyone remembers it wrong.. Who is in charge of the website is slowly changing the text of the xeps and the bylaws 😄. Only very slowy over time..
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  1945. MattJ I'd believe it
  1946. Zash Pfft, fantasy. I believe in Science! Therefore it must be a quantum wizard doing physics that causes the wave-function to collapse into additional sections when the XEPs are observed.
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  1948. moparisthebest nice! I propose we elect Menel to the position of XSF lawyer
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  1957. Kev It's my favourite fantasy, I think, assuming you're referring to Mistborn, although that's *slightly* offtopic :)
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