XSF Discussion - 2022-12-04

ralphm: like emus said

moparisthebest: yes dnssec is a must :)

+1

flow, making namespace prefixes (implicitly or explicitly) available to the application is exposing a detail of the serialization. making use of that detail should never be necessary, so better avoid that temptation.

too many things, if exposed to namespace prefixes, make dumb decisions like matching on a prefix instead of on a URI, so better take those tools away

Vs

jonas’: while you are correct, in fact that mistake got us here, too many things in the wild simply won't work if the stream prefix isn't 'stream'

moparisthebest: then those things are too broken to care about

singpolyma: ejabberd is one example

I stand by my statement

If people want their stuff to work they have to make it not be hopelessly broken on the fundamentals :)

You can design around bugs sometimes, but anything that fundamental just has to work to enter consideration

I mean someone is free to go around trying to fix everything, but untill a few years after all those patches are accepted we'll still need to use stream:stream in software we want to work in the wild, and that seems rather low on priority

> Interoperability Note: For historical reasons, an implementation MAY accept only the prefix 'stream' for the stream namespace (resulting in prefixed names such as <stream:stream> and <stream:features>); this specification retains that allowance from [RFC3920] for the purpose of backward compatibility.

Nice roundabout way of saying MUST send `<stream:stream xmlns:stream="...">`

Yep, don't fight the man

That and the separate namespaces for c2s and s2s (and components and BOSH and WS...) would have been nice to fix for XMPP 2.0 at some point in the distant future.

moparisthebest: as I said yesterday: an XML generator should allow *defining* prefixes precisely for such cases. a parser should never expose them to prevent such things from happening in the first place

So all the programmer should be dealing with is (namespace, name) tuples

Zash: or ideally just name, which includes namespace

I would consider that an implementation detail.

exactly

jonas’: yes, nice